2018-01-28 FMG FGB WGM

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HL7 TSC FGB/FMG Meeting Minutes

Location: Fulton - 3rd Floor

Date: 2018-01-28
Time: 12:30 PM
Note taker(s): Anne
FGB Co-Chair/CTO Members
x Lorraine Constable x Grahame Grieve x David Hay
x Dave Shaver x Ewout Kramer x Lloyd McKenzie (FMG)
x Wayne Kubick Calvin Beebe Cecil Lynch
FMG Members
x Hans Buitendijk x Brian Postlethwaite x Paul Knapp
x Josh Mandel x John Moehrke Brian Pech
observers/guests x Ben McCallister, Mary Kay McDaniel, Rik Smithies, Oyvind Aassve


  • Roll Call
  • Agenda Review
  • Discussion topics
    • Key ballot issues/priorities
    • Key messages/objectives for this meeting
    • Mon Q5 Co-chairs meeting presentation
    • Plan for R4 ballot publication timelines


  • Roll Call
  • Agenda Review
    • Add FGB/SGB merger
    • MOTION to accept: Hans/Rik
  • Discussion topics
    • Key ballot issues/priorities
      • 320 comments out of the ballot. 60 were to normative content that had potential to result in substantive change, although many were not persuasive. Nothing has jumped out in the set of issues raised that seemed terribly scary, but nothing that puts into question our ability to be ready for the next ballot. Priorities should be normative-related issues and they are flagged that way in gforge. Half of the normative stuff is FHIR-I and the rest is divided between Observation and Patient. Most Patient stuff is related to gender, and Observation is spread out a bit. Grahame asks when the stuff is going to get into gforge; Lloyd notes that Josh is planning on working on it today. In terms of implementation guides, 6 were out for ballot and we have the cleaned up spreadsheet for one of them. Sponsoring WGs need to get those into gforge.
    • Key messages/objectives for this meeting
      • Want to remind of the existence of maturity metrics for all artifacts and get them to start filling out the spreadsheet (especially for normative). Anyone FMM3 or higher should definitely have the spreadsheet filled out. Depending on outcome of TSC meeting, will issue a reminder to provide feedback on JIRA ballot requirements on Monday night. Need to also remind about the deadlines because they are tight. Also need to have folks make sure they don’t have a backlog of tracker items going into the next ballot. Grahame notes that there may be anxiety arising over normative content. Wayne: There needs to be compelling reason to go Normative. Lloyd: If a WG is nervous about a portion of their material, could split it. This makes things harder for implementers, but if it’s a choice between not locking it down at all and locking down 95% of it, we would likely lean towards that option.
      • Reviewed rules for inter-version change/Patient Resource. Based on reconciliation, the WG might say the patient linking section isn’t nailed down very well, so they’ll mark that section as non-normative. One of the other reasons to consider that is that, in the future we might have additional elements that we want to introduce that don’t go normative instantly. The WG should propose those levels to FMG with the rationale so we don’t have a patchwork of approaches. Need to emphasize that approach in our messaging. Key criteria is that the resource can’t go normative unless the normative portions are usable on their own. At this point, more normative candidates can’t be added before next ballot – they can only drop out after FMG review.
      • Discussion over the criteria for dropping from normative. Is not nailed down yet but will be forthcoming. Discussion over rules for determining ballot levels. If content comes forward in the May ballot that leads us to change ballot levels on certain content, we can reballot in September, and if we change after that we miss our publication deadline.
      • Grahame wants to understand exactly what scope means for Normative in terms of using the ballot comments to determine ballot level. Desire is to resolve status during reconciliation. Paul will take to SGB.
      • Narrative content can be marked informative, but not resources. Hans asks how we handle sub-ballots. Paul states they are all complete ballots, you just have to call out specifically what is being balloted.
      • Reviewed May 2018 cycle deadlines at [1].
    • Mon Q5 Co-chairs meeting presentation
      • Ballot timelines and perhaps migration to JIRA
    • FGB and SGB have both voted to make recommendations that FGB merge into SGB. Do we need to meet tomorrow morning in FGB? The outstanding thing is recommendations for SGB members from FGB. Decision to meet at 7:30 rather than 7:00.
  • Adjourned at 1:35 pm