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Difference between revisions of "2017-05-11 PA WGM Minutes"

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| width="10%" colspan="1" align="right"|'''Facilitator'''
 
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| width="35%" colspan="1" align="left"|Line Saele
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| width="35%" colspan="1" align="left"|Brian Postlethwaite
 
| width="25%" colspan="1" align="right"|'''Scribe'''
 
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| width="30%" colspan="1" align="left"|Helen Drijfhout
 
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|colspan="2" | Telstra Health, Australia
 
|colspan="2" | Telstra Health, Australia
 
|-
 
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| X || Peter Jordan
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| X || Andrew Torrew
|colspan="2" | Gevity Consulting Inc.
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|colspan="2" | Cerner
 
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|-
 
| X || Christian Hay
 
| X || Christian Hay
 
|colspan="2" | GS1, Switzerland
 
|colspan="2" | GS1, Switzerland
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| X || Simone Heckmann
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'''Agenda Topics''' <br/>
 
'''Agenda Topics''' <br/>
 
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# FHIR R4 work
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# Wrap up and prepare for the next WGM.
  
 
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===Minutes===
 
===Minutes===
 
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'''Minutes/Conclusions Reached:'''<br/>
 
'''Minutes/Conclusions Reached:'''<br/>
Brian spoke with Lloyd about the Patient Active stuff. He is supporting it.<br/>
+
Talking about what is possible to bring ChargeItem to a next level. Simone thinks there will be German vendors attending the WGM in Cologne, but not in the next 2 WGM’s in the US.<br/>
So this would need some clarification and then this can be voted on.<br/>
+
At the moment we are not approving a ballot.<br/>
<br/>
+
We are fine with the V2.9 ballot, we don’t have to vote on that at the moment.<br/>
#11368  coveragePeriod -> period - 2016-09 core #526<br/>
+
Looking at the QA status of the FHIR resources.<br/>
The requested change on the Account resource has already been applied in STU3, it is even published.<br/>
+
Drew will take an action item to see if Cerner could participate in an Encounter, ChargeItem and Claim connectathon.<br/>
There is a wording issue in the active period, it still refers to “coveragePeriod”.<br/>  
+
Next months PA will concentrate on having all the existing PA FHIR resources upgraded to level 3+.<br/>
Action for Brian to file a new tracker item to change the text.<br/><br/>
+
Focus on preparing for a connectathon with Encounter, ChargeItem, Account and Claim.<br/>
# 11367 Change description of Coverage - 2016-09 core #525<br/>
+
We currently have 16 triaged tracker items on FHIR resources, 4 waiting for input, 1 deferred.<br/>
Brian: This will be put on the joint session with FM, Q2 on Thursday.<br/><br/>
+
Monitoring the progress on the FHIR directory content for the PSS.<br/>
#13345 Organization, Location include alias elements and extensions <br/>
+
FHIR Planning for the next months: <br/>
The Organization resource has received an alias item in STU3, before that there was a standard alias extension on Organization and Location. This can be removed.<br/>
+
1. Progress all PA FHIR resources to at least level 3 FMM (need to check ChargeItem)
The datatype is string, 0..* cardinality, same as the extension.<br/>
+
2. Final review Patient in preparation for Normative
Motion to remove the extensions made by Brian, seconded by Helen, accepted with 4-0-0.<br/><br/>
+
3. Prepare Proposal for a sept connectathon on Encounter, Account, ChargeItem, and Claim
#13264 Organization, Location, and Practitioner need support for Merge/Link/Unmerge <br/>
+
4. Valueset reviews / harmonization
Needs more discussion.<br/><br/>
+
5. Evaluate scopes for all resources to prepare for moving past FMM 3
#13235 add endpoint to group<br/>
+
6. OrganizationAffiliation resource development
Brian thinks we need more information on this. Practitioner already has an e-mail address, also Care Team will get an Contact Point. Is it then still needed in Group?<br/><br/>
+
7. Scheduling Project progress (co-ordinating PA, SOA, Argonaut, ...)
#10762  Wrong system used in practitioner example file<br/>
+
8. Directory Project progress (co-ordinating PA, ONC, US-Realm, US-Core, Australian projects, Canadian projects)
This is part of QA changes. The examples will be updated.<br/><br/>
+
9. FHIR Tracker issues
#13074 QA: Valueset warnings cleanup for Encounter and ChargeItem (draft) <br/>
+
10. Apply workflow patterns to the PA resources<br/><br/>
The QA warning is about update casing.<br/>
+
3 Year Workplan: <br/>
This seems to be already applied as part of QA.<br/>
+
Line has updated this on Monday this week, this does not need changes now.<br/>
Motion to accept the change made by Brian, seconded by Helen, accepted with 4-0-0.<br/><br/>
+
Timelines (from FMG / Lloyd):<br/>
#13020 Encounter Length is Quantity search, not Number<br/>
+
- Dec 2017 (Jan ballot) – for comment<br/>
Length of the Encounter has been changed from positive integer to duration, so the Search example doesn’t fit anymore.<br/>
+
- Apr 2018 (May ballot) – STU + normative<br/>
Motion made by Brian to update the search parameter for length from number to quantity. This datatype is compatible to duration. Seconded by Helen, accepted 4-0-0.<br/><br/>
+
- NOV 2018 – ready to publish<br/>
#12888 Add "Alternate Home" to EncounterDischargeDisposition value set<br/>
+
Resources that we would like to go normative:<br/>
In Canada there is a need for a concept like “discharged to home, but not the patients own home”.<br/>
+
- Patient<br/>
This sounds reasonable.<br/>
+
It makes more sense to upgrade the Provider registry resources to level 5, to be able to push them together to normative later. This effects Organization, Location, Practitioner, PractitionerRole, Endpoint, HealthcareService.<br/>
Helen remarks that the proposed code is “ALTDISHM”, why the “DIS” in this code? Brian agrees there is no need for this. All the codes are for Discharge Disposition.<br/>
+
To achieve that these resources will have to be in the Connectathons in September and January.<br/>
Suggestion to make this “alt-home”.<br/><br/>
+
Action for Brian to report our status to FMG.<br/>
Motion to accept the change made by Brian, seconded by Peter, accepted with 4-0-0.<br/><br/>
+
Some examples are for single resources, some others are Bundles of related resources. Brian will try to create these Bundle examples.<br/>
#12722 Replace organization type Insurance Company with Payer<br/>
+
Work Group Health: Line will update this after the meeting. <br/>
Discussion about deprecating Insurance Company: there are several countries, like The Netherlands and Norway, in which still insurance companies are paying for the hospital services. <br/>
+
Simone will try to be on the calls. The current time is good for Europe (9:00 PM). Drew will be on the calls more often.<br/>
We are quite happy with adding Payer, but not with dropping “Ins”.<br/>
+
Motion to adjourn from Simone, seconded by Drew, passed 4-0-0.<br/>
The valueset is an Example, so this will likely will be overruled locally.<br/>
+
 
Motion to add the concept Payer as indicated made by Brian, seconded by Helen, accepted with 4-0-0.<br/><br/>
+
 
#12854 Remove/anonymize ical mappings from Appointment resource definition<br/>
 
The present examples have Brains name and e-mail in it. Suggestion to remove that.<br/>
 
Brian moves to anonymize the examples. Peter seconds. Accepted with 4-0-0.<br/><br/>
 
#13066  QA: Location.mode should not be an modifier <br/>
 
Location.mode has a modifier on it, which according to Grahame is not appropriate.<br/>
 
Brian moves to remove the modifier as requested. Peter seconds. Accepted 4-0-0.<br/>
 
  
  
 
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| width="35%" colspan="1" align="left"|None
 
| width="25%" colspan="1" align="right"|'''Scribe'''
 
| width="25%" colspan="1" align="right"|'''Scribe'''
| width="30%" colspan="1" align="left"|Helen Drijfhout
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|colspan="2" | HL7 Netherlands
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|colspan="2" | N/A
 
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| X || Line Saele
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|colspan="4" |'''Quorum Requirements Met''' (Chair + 2 members): '''No'''
|colspan="2" | HL7 Norway
 
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| X || Andrew Torres
 
|colspan="2" | Cerner
 
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|colspan="2" | Epic
 
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# Tracker items
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Meeting cancelled due to lack of co-chair
 
'''Supporting Documents'''<br/>
 
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'''Minutes/Conclusions Reached:'''<br/>
'''Tracker items'''
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Meeting was cancelled due to lack of participants (co-chairs).
#12270 Add DICOM mappings for Organization<br/>
 
This item has no extra information provided. Line changes this to “wait for input” from Brad Generaux.<br/><br/>
 
#10304  Organization Affiliation <br/>
 
Will be discussed later.<br/>
 
#13264 Organization, Location, and Practitioner need support for Merge/Link/Unmerge <br/>
 
We ask John Moehrke if he will be available tomorrow to discuss this.<br/><br/>
 
#12920 Person definition/description needs work<br/>
 
Lloyd suggests a change of the definition text:<br/>
 
The resource needs to state in the first line of its definition that "Person is a linking resource used to convey shared demographics for one or more other Patient, Practitioner and/or RelatedPerson resources".  A later sentence needs to say "Person instances are never directly referenced as actors (authors, subjects, performers, etc.)  Individual actors are identified as either Patient, Practitioner or RelatedPerson, depending on the role of the individual when undertaking the action"<br/>
 
This looks reasonable.<br/>
 
Moved to accept the proposed change by Michael: the text will be updated as requested. Seconded by Drew, accepted 3-0-0.<br/><br/>
 
#13033 8.3.3 De-normalized Data<br/>
 
Suggestion to change the text of the Person resource:<br/>
 
The second sentence in the first paragraph states:<br/>
 
    This is intentional and highlights that the "disconnectedness" of the resources.<br/>
 
Since the word "disconnectedness" portrays a negative connotation, you might consider using the words "loose coupling" instead. For instance:<br/>
 
    This is intentional and highlights the loose coupling of the resources.<br/>
 
<br/>
 
Moved to accept the proposed change by Drew: the text will be updated as requested. Seconded by Michael, accepted 3-0-0.<br/><br/>
 
#12726  Appointment needs a property for the actual arrival time. <br/>
 
Drew: finds this not persuasive, because the Appointment is in the future. Arrival time can already be put in the Encounter with the Status history.<br/>
 
Drew moves to make this non-persuasive, Michael seconds, accepted 3-0-0.<br/><br/>
 
#12739 Need a per-participant period for Appointment <br/>
 
Cooper Thompson asks to add the period on the participant backbone item in the Appointment resource, because participants may be involved with the appointment for different periods in time.<br/>
 
After having some discussion of the options the motion is made by Michael to add period 0..1 to the participant. Drew seconds, accepted 3-0-0.<br/><br/>
 
#12304 Add IHE PCD MEMLS data items to FHIR DSTU2 Location resource<br/>
 
Monroe Pattillo asks to align the Location resource with MEMLS profile from IHE.<br/>
 
Drew remarks that some of the extra attributes, like accuracy and speed, are attributes of the device which has been used, not of the Location itself. The Location is fixed and has GPS coordinates.<br/>
 
Drew moves to make this not-persuasive. Michael seconds. Accepted 3-0-0.<br/><br/>
 
#9249 Manage the Provenance of Practitioner (and Other Resources) using an Extension<br/>
 
The suggestion is to use the Provenance resource.<br/>
 
There has been voted on this in January 2016, to refer this for future use. It would be tested in a connectathon by Brian, but there has not been a follow-up. We ask Brian for more information.<br/><br/>
 
#12365  How should we represent an Endpoint.address for a v2 mllp connection?  <br/>
 
There is an example in the tracker item.<br/>
 
We need an IP address and a port number. Michael types the example in the resolution.<br/>
 
Michael moves to add the example, Drew seconds, accepted 3-0-0.<br/><br/>
 
#11367 Change description of Coverage - 2016-09 core #525<br/>
 
The Coverage resource is owned by FM, so we will not vote on this today.<br/><br/>
 
#12364 Added 'Direct-project' to valueset-endpoint-connection-type <br/>
 
Michael: This is about direct messages, not about the project “direct-project”, that doesn’t exist anymore. But looking at the wiki page for the Direct project (http://wiki.directproject.org/), he changes his mind and finds this persuasive. Drew seconds the motion. Accepted 3-0-0.<br/><br/>
 
 
 
'''Line has just heard that Alex deLeon has been re-elected as a co-chair of PA!'''
 
 
 
 
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* Action item: Andrew Torres to check implication of changing the relationship from 0..1 to 0..*<br/>
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Latest revision as of 11:30, 14 June 2017


Return to: WGM Minutes > 2017 > May Madrid

Patient Administration Work Group Minutes - May 11, 2017

Thursday Q1

HL7 Patient Administration Meeting Minutes

Location: Marriott Madrid Auditorium, Potsdam Conference Room

Date: 2017-05-11
Time: Thursday Q1
Facilitator Brian Postlethwaite Scribe Iryna Roy
Attendee Name Affiliation
X Helen Drijfhout HL7 Netherlands
X Brian Postlethwaite Telstra Health, Australia
X Iryna Roy Gevity
X Michael Donnelly Epic
X Andrew Torres Cerner
Quorum Requirements Met (Chair + 2 members): Yes

Agenda

Agenda Topics
Welcome/introductions

  1. Tracker Items

Supporting Documents

Minutes

  1. 9989 – Actor cardinality in a Slot resource.

The group discusses the business scenarios for booking multiple slots and multiple actors for a schedule. Brian explains the reasoning for the modeling of the current structure. The complexity can be either carried by the client or by a server that books an appointment. The current model supports the Outlook-style scheduling. Details of the discussion and thinking process are in the tracker comments.
Option 1: both actors defined on one slot
Option 2: having slot resources for each author
Both options introduce complexity related to searching of available slots/actors. The current scheduling project and proposed operations in this space will be working on resolution of these issues.
The issue stays as “Triaged”. The discussion over the phone to follow up

  1. 12363 – Add _include Endpoint support for Provider Directory related resources.

Already completed. Added to all Provider Directory resources. Fixed as part of QA for STU3 and no need to vote.

  1. 13366 – Clarification to be added to explain a difference between Endpoint and ContactPoint

The group agrees to add a clarification: Endpoints are used facilitate system to system communication vs ContactPoint that provides physical and official contact information. The details of the amendment are in the tracker.
Moved by Michael Donnelly/Second Andrew Torres
Discussion: None
Vote: 4-0-0

  1. 13235 – Add Endpoint to a group resource.

The PA group discussed possible scenarios. The group resource does not have a scenario for a system Endpoint. The group believes the request is non persuasive. Additional details are in the tracker.
Moved by Andrew Torres /Second Michael Donnelly
Discussion: None
Vote: 4-0-0



Meeting Outcomes

Actions (Include Owner, Action Item, and due date)
  • None


Next Meeting/Preliminary Agenda Items
  • .

Thursday Q2

HL7 Patient Administration Meeting Minutes

Location: Marriott Madrid Auditorium, Potsdam Conference Room

Date: 2017-05-11
Time: Thursday Q2
Facilitator Brian Postlethwaite Scribe Iryna Roy
Attendee Name Affiliation
X Brian Postlethwaite Telstra Health, Australia
X Helen Drijfhout HL7 Netherlands
X Simone Heckmann Gefyra, Germany
X Andrew Torres Cerner, USA
X Paul Knapp Knapp Consulting Inc
X Iryna Roy . Gevity Consulting Inc
X Ashley Duncan Furore
X Attila Farkas CHI
X Marten Smits Furore
X Ardon Toonstra Furore
Quorum Requirements Met (Chair +2 members): Yes

Agenda

Agenda Topics
Welcome/introductions
• Tracker Items

Supporting Documents

Minutes

Minutes/Conclusions Reached:
The FM group didn’t have a representation. Paul was the only one attending. Decided to move the review of Account and ChargeItem resources to a PA call.
Agenda change: Tracker Items review is added.

  1. 13155 – Waiting for Ardon, a requestor
  2. 12685 – Linking of Accounts required.

Discussion about use cases for linking accounts. For example, an account that subsumes all the charges of a previous account (children reference a master). Simone will go back to a company requestor for more detailed information about types of possible account linkages. Andrew Torres will bring Cerner requirements as well. The discussion will continue during the next PA Call.

  1. 13155 – Clarification required for Encounter.serviceProvider.

A group discussed various use cases to challenge the description. Details of the discussion and examples are attached to the tracker. Persuasive. Moved by Ardon Toonstra/Second by Andrew Torres
Discussion: None
Vote: 8-0-0

Meeting Outcomes

Actions (Include Owner, Action Item, and due date)
  • • None
Next Meeting/Preliminary Agenda Items
  • .

Thursday Q3

HL7 Patient Administration Meeting Minutes

Location: Marriott Madrid Auditorium, Potsdam Conference Room

Date: 2017-05-11
Time: Thursday Q3
Facilitator Brian Postlethwaite Scribe Helen Drijfhout
Attendee Name Affiliation
X Helen Drijfhout HL7 Netherlands
X Brian Postlethwaite Telstra Health, Australia
X Andrew Torrew Cerner
X Christian Hay GS1, Switzerland
X Simone Heckmann Gefyra
Quorum Requirements Met (Chair + 2 members): Yes

Agenda

Agenda Topics

  1. Wrap up and prepare for the next WGM.

Supporting Documents

Minutes

Minutes/Conclusions Reached:
Talking about what is possible to bring ChargeItem to a next level. Simone thinks there will be German vendors attending the WGM in Cologne, but not in the next 2 WGM’s in the US.
At the moment we are not approving a ballot.
We are fine with the V2.9 ballot, we don’t have to vote on that at the moment.
Looking at the QA status of the FHIR resources.
Drew will take an action item to see if Cerner could participate in an Encounter, ChargeItem and Claim connectathon.
Next months PA will concentrate on having all the existing PA FHIR resources upgraded to level 3+.
Focus on preparing for a connectathon with Encounter, ChargeItem, Account and Claim.
We currently have 16 triaged tracker items on FHIR resources, 4 waiting for input, 1 deferred.
Monitoring the progress on the FHIR directory content for the PSS.
FHIR Planning for the next months:
1. Progress all PA FHIR resources to at least level 3 FMM (need to check ChargeItem) 2. Final review Patient in preparation for Normative 3. Prepare Proposal for a sept connectathon on Encounter, Account, ChargeItem, and Claim 4. Valueset reviews / harmonization 5. Evaluate scopes for all resources to prepare for moving past FMM 3 6. OrganizationAffiliation resource development 7. Scheduling Project progress (co-ordinating PA, SOA, Argonaut, ...) 8. Directory Project progress (co-ordinating PA, ONC, US-Realm, US-Core, Australian projects, Canadian projects) 9. FHIR Tracker issues 10. Apply workflow patterns to the PA resources

3 Year Workplan:
Line has updated this on Monday this week, this does not need changes now.
Timelines (from FMG / Lloyd):
- Dec 2017 (Jan ballot) – for comment
- Apr 2018 (May ballot) – STU + normative
- NOV 2018 – ready to publish
Resources that we would like to go normative:
- Patient
It makes more sense to upgrade the Provider registry resources to level 5, to be able to push them together to normative later. This effects Organization, Location, Practitioner, PractitionerRole, Endpoint, HealthcareService.
To achieve that these resources will have to be in the Connectathons in September and January.
Action for Brian to report our status to FMG.
Some examples are for single resources, some others are Bundles of related resources. Brian will try to create these Bundle examples.
Work Group Health: Line will update this after the meeting.
Simone will try to be on the calls. The current time is good for Europe (9:00 PM). Drew will be on the calls more often.
Motion to adjourn from Simone, seconded by Drew, passed 4-0-0.





Meeting Outcomes

Actions (Include Owner, Action Item, and due date)
  • None
Next Meeting/Preliminary Agenda Items
  • .

Thursday Q4

HL7 Patient Administration Meeting Minutes

Location: Marriott Madrid Auditorium, Potsdam Conference Room

Date: 2017-01-11
Time: Thursday Q4
Facilitator None Scribe None
Attendee Name Affiliation
X None N/A
Quorum Requirements Met (Chair + 2 members): No

Agenda

Agenda Topics
Meeting cancelled due to lack of co-chair Supporting Documents

Minutes

Minutes/Conclusions Reached:
Meeting was cancelled due to lack of participants (co-chairs).

Meeting Outcomes

Actions (Include Owner, Action Item, and due date)
  • None
Next Meeting/Preliminary Agenda Items
  • .

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