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Difference between revisions of "2018-10-17 FMG concall"

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|colspan="4" align="center" style="background:#f0f0f0;"| '''yes/no'''
 
|colspan="4" align="center" style="background:#f0f0f0;"| '''yes/no'''
 
|-
 
|-
−
| Co chairs|| ||David Hay || ||Lloyd McKenzie
+
| Co chairs|| x||David Hay ||Regrets ||Lloyd McKenzie
 
|-
 
|-
 
| ex-officio||.||Wayne Kubick, CTO
 
| ex-officio||.||Wayne Kubick, CTO
Line 22: Line 22:
 
| colspan="2"| Members ||colspan="2"|Members||colspan="2"|Members ||colspan="2"|Observers/Guests
 
| colspan="2"| Members ||colspan="2"|Members||colspan="2"|Members ||colspan="2"|Observers/Guests
 
|-
 
|-
−
| || Hans Buitendijk|| ||Brian Postlethwaite  || ||Paul Knapp || || Anne W., scribe
+
| || Hans Buitendijk||x ||Brian Postlethwaite  ||x ||Paul Knapp || x|| Anne W., scribe
 
|-
 
|-
−
| ||Josh Mandel  || ||John Moehrke|| ||Brian Pech || ||  
+
|x ||Josh Mandel  || ||John Moehrke||x ||Brian Pech || ||  
 
|-
 
|-
−
| ||Grahame Grieve  || || || || ||.||<!--guest-->
+
|x||Grahame Grieve  || || || || ||x||AMS, Didi Davis, Eric Haas
 
|-
 
|-
 
|}
 
|}
Line 51: Line 51:
 
*Review Items
 
*Review Items
 
**[https://gforge.hl7.org/gf/download/trackeritem/19429/17035/VRDR%20FHIR%20IG%20PSS.docx Vital Records Death Reporting IG PSS] and [http://wiki.hl7.org/index.php?title=VRDR_FHIR_IG_Proposal IG Proposal]
 
**[https://gforge.hl7.org/gf/download/trackeritem/19429/17035/VRDR%20FHIR%20IG%20PSS.docx Vital Records Death Reporting IG PSS] and [http://wiki.hl7.org/index.php?title=VRDR_FHIR_IG_Proposal IG Proposal]
−
**SMART publication request
 
 
**Ballot Review/FMG-assigned ballot items
 
**Ballot Review/FMG-assigned ballot items
 
*Discussion Topics
 
*Discussion Topics
Line 80: Line 79:
  
 
==Minutes==
 
==Minutes==
 +
*Roll Call
 +
*Agenda Check
 +
**MOTION to accept: Josh/Brian Post
 +
**VOTE: All in favor
 +
*Minutes from [[2018-09-26 FMG concall]]
 +
**MOTION to accept: Josh/Grahame
 +
**VOTE: Brian Post abstains; remaining in favor
 +
*Minutes from [[2018-09-30_FMG_WGM]]
 +
**MOTION to accept: Paul/Brian Post
 +
**VOTE: All in favor
 +
*Minutes from [[2018-10-04_FMG_WGM]]
 +
**MOTION to approve: Paul/Brian Pech
 +
**VOTE: All in favor
 +
*Action items
 +
**Grahame to put together something to describe a desired level of BR&R community engagement in order to own Substance
 +
***Carry forward
 +
**Lloyd to draft a process for approving technically breaking changes that are believed not to impact any implementations and submit for review by FMG, MnM and SGB
 +
***Carry forward
 +
**Anne to contact BR&R cochairs/modeling facilitator to ask them to update the resource relationships section of AdverseEvent
 +
***Carry forward
 +
**Hans to reach out to OO on BiologicallyDerivedProduct at WGM
 +
***Carry forward
 +
**Brian Post to add RIM scope and boundaries section to ChargeItemDefinition
 +
***Carry forward
 +
**Hans to check with OO, CDS, and CQI about DeviceUseStatement at WGM
 +
***Carry forward
 +
**Hans to check with Lorraine about EntryDefinition at WGM
 +
***Carry forward
 +
**Brian Post to update Invoice
 +
***Carry forward
 +
**Hans to follow up with OO on ObservationDefinition2  at WGM
 +
***Carry forward
 +
**John to draft language regarding virtual Connectathons
 +
***Carry forward
 +
**Grahame to identify and fix bugs and US Core before FMG/TSC approval
 +
***Issues have been fixed.
 +
****MOTION to approve publication request to move forward to TSC: Grahame/Josh
 +
****VOTE: All in favor
 +
*****ACTION: Anne to add to TSC vote
 +
**Suggest to HL7 to include a Zulip link for WGM attendee questions about where they should go
 +
***Complete
 +
*Review Items
 +
**[https://gforge.hl7.org/gf/download/trackeritem/19429/17035/VRDR%20FHIR%20IG%20PSS.docx Vital Records Death Reporting IG PSS] and [http://wiki.hl7.org/index.php?title=VRDR_FHIR_IG_Proposal IG Proposal]
 +
***AMS here to present
 +
***Reviews PSS. Communicates death reports from the state public health agency to the federal health agency. Will bring in work from MITRE. Will use FHIR STU3. Will hopefully reuse some of this for the communication between funeral directors and the state at some point in the future.
 +
****MOTION to accept: Josh/Paul
 +
****VOTE: All in favor
 +
***FHIR IG Proposal:
 +
****MOTION to accept: Josh/Brian Post
 +
****VOTE: All in favor
 +
**SMART Application Launch publication request:
 +
***Added OpenID Connect as a parent standard
 +
****MOTION to approve: Josh/Paul
 +
****VOTE: All in favor
 +
*****ACTION: Anne to add to TSC e-vote
 +
**Ballot Review/FMG-assigned ballot items
 +
***Don’t seem to be an assigned to FMG
 +
*Discussion Topics
 +
**Continuous maintenance balloting – Paul
 +
***SGB discussed continuous maintenance balloting in Baltimore. Going through ANSI material, we didn’t have a perspective from FMG on what we want to get out of continuous vs. ad hoc balloting. It wasn’t clear that there is an actual up side to continuous when we reviewed the ANSI material. Discussed differences in types of balloting. If you do continuous, you set a periodicity, gather information into an artifact, which you then take into ballot at that time; then the entire specification is under ballot. You don’t get to scope it. Wanted to understand FHIR’s intention/what the perceived advantage is. David: currently we do ballot the whole spec. Brian Post: We had been, but now we have some portions that are normative. Paul: Under continuous, we think that you couldn’t ballot those separately. Not sure you could exclude content under the continuous maintenance rules. Want to know the perceived advantage of FHIR’s previous request to move to continuous maintenance. Grahame isn’t sure there was a perceived advantage. Paul: Could it be that we just wanted to say that we’re going to ballot on a regular schedule? Grahame: That was the thrust behind it. We won’t be sticking to a regular cycle anyway just because we’ll be consulting with the market. It’s possible in a few years that we might do it down the road. Paul: Not sure that continuous maintenance as defined by ANSI is ever what we’re going to want. But we might do ad hoc balloting and announce a regular schedule.
 +
****Grahame: FMG thanks SGB for the advice and agrees that we won’t adopt continuous maintenance at this time. If we believe something significant changes in the future, we’ll revisit the question.
 +
 +
**What to do with the QA results from prior to first ballot
 +
***We have QA that was done that was only partially applied; 20-30 tasks are hanging around in gforge. Grahame suggests we abandon these tasks because things have changed so much since then. Lloyd thinks that we shouldn’t do that to honor the work people did on it. Paul: Throwing away people’s efforts isn’t a great message. Grahame: But we have previously processed all this stuff. It’s supposed to be broken links, grammar, typos and stuff. Very often it’s harmless grammar changes that are proposed, and different people suggests different changes on the same material. Because of that, many of the changes have been fixed in subsequent work. Paul: It’s not that worrisome then – other things are more important. David: So the general feeling is that the yield is low and the chance is high that most of them have become redundant or been caught. Should mark them as deprecated.
 +
**Criteria for what you need to have to claim that an IG is international in scope
 +
***There is confusion over committees over what they should mark their projects. If you are going to mark it universal, there should be international participation. Paul: SGB has taken this on and has some criteria in the works. The instructions on the PSS form are quite clear but people don’t read it. Grahame notes that Melva will be moving her focus to IGs, so she’ll be keeping an active eye on this issue.
 +
**Criteria for inclusion of extensions in core vs. IGs
 +
***Add to next week/future call with both Lloyd and Grahame present
 +
**What content is/isn't attracting ballot feedback
 +
***Add to future week to discuss when John is present
 +
**PSS form:
 +
***Has it been updated to set an expectation to capture plans (including funding, community) for long-term maintenance of whatever project artifacts have been created?
 +
***Has it been updated to include plans for community formation, engagement and implementation?
 +
****Grahame: We should review the PSS form to suggest changes
 +
****Add to next week
 +
**Setting expectations around community establishment and real-world testing before content is allowed to go to ballot
 +
***Part of the above issue; add to next week
 +
*Reports
 +
**Connectathon management (David/Brian)
 +
***Time to do a call for tracks.
 +
****ACTION: David to set up track proposal pages.
 +
***Will have more space for the next couple of Connectathons. Noise was an issue at the last one.
 +
**SGB –
 +
***Working on precepts around Tooling and HTA/vocabulary issues.
 +
**MnM –
 +
***No report
 +
**[[FMG Liaisons]] –
 +
***No report
 +
**Ballot Planning
 +
***Grahame: Changes have been applied. We’re holding to deadlines well. Large amount of editorial work is out there for committees, but we’re on top of core. Paul and Brian Post report good response from respective communities.
 +
*Adjourned at 5:16 pm Eastern
 +
  
  
Line 90: Line 181:
 
|-
 
|-
 
|colspan="4" |'''Next Meeting/Preliminary Agenda Items'''<br/>
 
|colspan="4" |'''Next Meeting/Preliminary Agenda Items'''<br/>
−
[[2018-10-17 FMG concall]]
+
[[2018-10-24 FMG concall]]
  
 
|}
 
|}

Latest revision as of 19:09, 24 October 2018

HL7 TSC FMG Meeting Minutes

Location:
https://global.gotomeeting.com/join/279790597
(voice and screen)

Date: 2018-10-17
Time: 4:00 PM U.S. Eastern
Chair: Note taker(s): Anne W.
Quorum = chair + 4 yes/no
Co chairs x David Hay Regrets Lloyd McKenzie
ex-officio . Wayne Kubick, CTO
Members Members Members Observers/Guests
Hans Buitendijk x Brian Postlethwaite x Paul Knapp x Anne W., scribe
x Josh Mandel John Moehrke x Brian Pech
x Grahame Grieve x AMS, Didi Davis, Eric Haas

Agenda

  • Roll Call
  • Agenda Check
  • Minutes from 2018-09-26 FMG concall
  • Minutes from 2018-09-30_FMG_WGM
  • Minutes from 2018-10-04_FMG_WGM
  • Action items
    • Grahame to put together something to describe a desired level of BR&R community engagement in order to own Substance
    • Lloyd to draft a process for approving technically breaking changes that are believed not to impact any implementations and submit for review by FMG, MnM and SGB
    • Anne to contact BR&R cochairs/modeling facilitator to ask them to update the resource relationships section of AdverseEvent
    • Hans to reach out to OO on BiologicallyDerivedProduct at WGM
    • Brian Post to add RIM scope and boundaries section to ChargeItemDefinition
    • Hans to check with OO, CDS, and CQI about DeviceUseStatement at WGM
    • Hans to check with Lorraine about EntryDefinition at WGM
    • Brian Post to update Invoice
    • Hans to follow up with OO on ObservationDefinition2 at WGM
    • John to draft language regarding virtual Connectathons
    • Grahame to identify and fix bugs and US Core before FMG/TSC approval
    • Suggest to HL7 to include a Zulip link for WGM attendee questions about where they should go
  • Review Items
  • Discussion Topics
    • Continuous maintenance balloting - Paul
    • What to do with the QA results from prior to first ballot
    • Criteria for what you need to have to claim that an IG is international in scope
    • Criteria for inclusion of extensions in core vs. IGs
    • What content is/isn't attracting ballot feedback
    • PSS form:
      • Has it been updated to set an expectation to capture plans (including funding, community) for long-term maintenance of whatever project artifacts have been created?
      • Has it been updated to include plans for community formation, engagement and implementation?
    • Setting expectations around community establishment and real-world testing before content is allowed to go to ballot
  • Reports
    • Connectathon management (David/Brian)
    • SGB –
    • MnM –
    • FMG Liaisons –
  • Process management
  • AOB (Any Other Business)

Minutes

  • Roll Call
  • Agenda Check
    • MOTION to accept: Josh/Brian Post
    • VOTE: All in favor
  • Minutes from 2018-09-26 FMG concall
    • MOTION to accept: Josh/Grahame
    • VOTE: Brian Post abstains; remaining in favor
  • Minutes from 2018-09-30_FMG_WGM
    • MOTION to accept: Paul/Brian Post
    • VOTE: All in favor
  • Minutes from 2018-10-04_FMG_WGM
    • MOTION to approve: Paul/Brian Pech
    • VOTE: All in favor
  • Action items
    • Grahame to put together something to describe a desired level of BR&R community engagement in order to own Substance
      • Carry forward
    • Lloyd to draft a process for approving technically breaking changes that are believed not to impact any implementations and submit for review by FMG, MnM and SGB
      • Carry forward
    • Anne to contact BR&R cochairs/modeling facilitator to ask them to update the resource relationships section of AdverseEvent
      • Carry forward
    • Hans to reach out to OO on BiologicallyDerivedProduct at WGM
      • Carry forward
    • Brian Post to add RIM scope and boundaries section to ChargeItemDefinition
      • Carry forward
    • Hans to check with OO, CDS, and CQI about DeviceUseStatement at WGM
      • Carry forward
    • Hans to check with Lorraine about EntryDefinition at WGM
      • Carry forward
    • Brian Post to update Invoice
      • Carry forward
    • Hans to follow up with OO on ObservationDefinition2 at WGM
      • Carry forward
    • John to draft language regarding virtual Connectathons
      • Carry forward
    • Grahame to identify and fix bugs and US Core before FMG/TSC approval
      • Issues have been fixed.
        • MOTION to approve publication request to move forward to TSC: Grahame/Josh
        • VOTE: All in favor
          • ACTION: Anne to add to TSC vote
    • Suggest to HL7 to include a Zulip link for WGM attendee questions about where they should go
      • Complete
  • Review Items
    • Vital Records Death Reporting IG PSS and IG Proposal
      • AMS here to present
      • Reviews PSS. Communicates death reports from the state public health agency to the federal health agency. Will bring in work from MITRE. Will use FHIR STU3. Will hopefully reuse some of this for the communication between funeral directors and the state at some point in the future.
        • MOTION to accept: Josh/Paul
        • VOTE: All in favor
      • FHIR IG Proposal:
        • MOTION to accept: Josh/Brian Post
        • VOTE: All in favor
    • SMART Application Launch publication request:
      • Added OpenID Connect as a parent standard
        • MOTION to approve: Josh/Paul
        • VOTE: All in favor
          • ACTION: Anne to add to TSC e-vote
    • Ballot Review/FMG-assigned ballot items
      • Don’t seem to be an assigned to FMG
  • Discussion Topics
    • Continuous maintenance balloting – Paul
      • SGB discussed continuous maintenance balloting in Baltimore. Going through ANSI material, we didn’t have a perspective from FMG on what we want to get out of continuous vs. ad hoc balloting. It wasn’t clear that there is an actual up side to continuous when we reviewed the ANSI material. Discussed differences in types of balloting. If you do continuous, you set a periodicity, gather information into an artifact, which you then take into ballot at that time; then the entire specification is under ballot. You don’t get to scope it. Wanted to understand FHIR’s intention/what the perceived advantage is. David: currently we do ballot the whole spec. Brian Post: We had been, but now we have some portions that are normative. Paul: Under continuous, we think that you couldn’t ballot those separately. Not sure you could exclude content under the continuous maintenance rules. Want to know the perceived advantage of FHIR’s previous request to move to continuous maintenance. Grahame isn’t sure there was a perceived advantage. Paul: Could it be that we just wanted to say that we’re going to ballot on a regular schedule? Grahame: That was the thrust behind it. We won’t be sticking to a regular cycle anyway just because we’ll be consulting with the market. It’s possible in a few years that we might do it down the road. Paul: Not sure that continuous maintenance as defined by ANSI is ever what we’re going to want. But we might do ad hoc balloting and announce a regular schedule.
        • Grahame: FMG thanks SGB for the advice and agrees that we won’t adopt continuous maintenance at this time. If we believe something significant changes in the future, we’ll revisit the question.
    • What to do with the QA results from prior to first ballot
      • We have QA that was done that was only partially applied; 20-30 tasks are hanging around in gforge. Grahame suggests we abandon these tasks because things have changed so much since then. Lloyd thinks that we shouldn’t do that to honor the work people did on it. Paul: Throwing away people’s efforts isn’t a great message. Grahame: But we have previously processed all this stuff. It’s supposed to be broken links, grammar, typos and stuff. Very often it’s harmless grammar changes that are proposed, and different people suggests different changes on the same material. Because of that, many of the changes have been fixed in subsequent work. Paul: It’s not that worrisome then – other things are more important. David: So the general feeling is that the yield is low and the chance is high that most of them have become redundant or been caught. Should mark them as deprecated.
    • Criteria for what you need to have to claim that an IG is international in scope
      • There is confusion over committees over what they should mark their projects. If you are going to mark it universal, there should be international participation. Paul: SGB has taken this on and has some criteria in the works. The instructions on the PSS form are quite clear but people don’t read it. Grahame notes that Melva will be moving her focus to IGs, so she’ll be keeping an active eye on this issue.
    • Criteria for inclusion of extensions in core vs. IGs
      • Add to next week/future call with both Lloyd and Grahame present
    • What content is/isn't attracting ballot feedback
      • Add to future week to discuss when John is present
    • PSS form:
      • Has it been updated to set an expectation to capture plans (including funding, community) for long-term maintenance of whatever project artifacts have been created?
      • Has it been updated to include plans for community formation, engagement and implementation?
        • Grahame: We should review the PSS form to suggest changes
        • Add to next week
    • Setting expectations around community establishment and real-world testing before content is allowed to go to ballot
      • Part of the above issue; add to next week
  • Reports
    • Connectathon management (David/Brian)
      • Time to do a call for tracks.
        • ACTION: David to set up track proposal pages.
      • Will have more space for the next couple of Connectathons. Noise was an issue at the last one.
    • SGB –
      • Working on precepts around Tooling and HTA/vocabulary issues.
    • MnM –
      • No report
    • FMG Liaisons –
      • No report
    • Ballot Planning
      • Grahame: Changes have been applied. We’re holding to deadlines well. Large amount of editorial work is out there for committees, but we’re on top of core. Paul and Brian Post report good response from respective communities.
  • Adjourned at 5:16 pm Eastern


Next Steps

Actions (Include Owner, Action Item, and due date)
Next Meeting/Preliminary Agenda Items

2018-10-24 FMG concall


Back to FHIR_Management_Group

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